53 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Discussion about custom hills.
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BLusiak
Posts: 1
Joined: 07 Dec 2021, 22:28

Re: 52 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by BLusiak »

Hi Jussi!
When I was browsing the dsj24.pl site, I noticed that eight of the verified hills were not added to online/record lists.
Wola Lubecka HS21; hill number 3331 (I can't post links yet)
Lech am Arlberg K110; hill number 3224
Gilowice HS19; hill number 2772
Cyców-Kolonia Druga K88; hill number 3337
Garmisch-Partenkirchen HS47; hill number 3330
Strachocina HS33; hill number 2155
And two hills below have been approved for over six months and have had their approval taken away after adding the 52 hills to online:
Radom HS118; hill number 2189
Dubrovnik K40; hill number 3086
Seven of the hills above have been approved for over half a year, except Wola Lubecka HS21, which has been verified 9 days ago.
I raised this matter on the official DSJ24.PL discord server, and was told by a member of the Gorisek Bros. that it's not an accident that these hills weren't added to online and that some unidentified members had some objections to these hills. I asked all non-Gorisek Bros. members of the Hill Inspection Team and they said that they had no idea that something was amiss with these hills. No feedback whatsoever was also given to the authors of these hills. The Gorisek Bros. member also told me that Ga-Pa HS47 was not added due to a wrong link in the internal spreadsheet, which raises the question why the hills weren't imported based on the checkmarks on the dsj24.pl site.
As I was a member of the hill verification commitee from May to November (I resigned due to lack of free time) I know that none of these hills have any defects that render them unplayable or cannot be fixed in a future update after adding to online. Furthermore, one of the Gorisek Bros members explanations was that the hills were not re-checked, but according to the new Hill approval process github com/Gorisek-Bros/hill-verification-process/blob/main/hill-approval-process-en.md and Hill verification criteria github com/Gorisek-Bros/hill-verification-process/blob/main/hill-approval-criteria-en.md (relevant excerpts below:) there is no clause describing reverification of hills which have the Approved status.
3.4 Current Approval Criteria apply to all non-Approved hills. This includes also hills that got Approved status with older Criteria, but lost their approval status later.
3.5 Hill Approval Criteria applies also to Ranked hills that are subject of Upgrade. Due to no possibility of profile change for already Ranked hills, profile criteria do not apply to these hills.
3.6 Any criteria changes must be discussed with Team members, other hillmakers and other DSJ4 players. Discussions should be held on Mediamond.fi (official DSJ4 forum) or DSJ24.PL Discord Server.
7.1 Approved Hill may be revoked (moved to status Created) in following cases:
7.1.1 Hill author requested revoking Approval status.
7.1.2 Team member suggested changes that have been accepted by Hill author.
7.1.3 Hill does not meet Hill Approval Criteria.
7.1.4 Mediamond asked for changes before marking hill as Ranked.
7.2 Approved Hill may be revoked by its author by uploading a new version of the hill.
As you can see above, current criteria apply only to non-approved and ranked hills, while somehow approved hills can be unverified for not meeting the criteria, which is an internal inconsistency (as an aside, the current criteria enforce mainly trivialities while being full of loopholes).
Furthermore, for example Gilowice HS19 would not be valid under the new criteria, as they allow only hills with hill size 20 or more, so any changes to the hill before adding it to online would mean that the hill can't be verified again. The hill authors also were under the rightful impression that the green checkmark next to their hill means that it will be added in the next batch of hills to online/record lists, especially as there was no feedback whatsoever that something was to be fixed.

To sum up, I suggest adding these eight hills to online/record lists straight off, so that the hill authors and HIT members feel that their work is valuable and appreciated and so that they feel that they are being treated fairly.
Jussi Koskela
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Re: 52 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by Jussi Koskela »

At least some of those missing hills had still some issues or were forgotten due to human err (the process is not automated). I'll figure it out. It's important to be sure that the physical properties of the hills won't require any changes once the hills are added to the hill record lists.
Jussi Koskela
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Re: 53 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by Jussi Koskela »

I have now added Garmisch-Partenkirchen HS47. The hill was accidentally left out from this update.
Lechoo
Posts: 83
Joined: 31 May 2012, 15:28

Re: 53 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by Lechoo »

When shall we expect CPU-players' support on those hills?
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Maciejo-96
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Re: 53 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by Maciejo-96 »

I think at the beginning of new year at least. The new hills still need some time to get enough data from online competitions.
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Andrej šunkar
Posts: 51
Joined: 03 Mar 2021, 15:25

Re: 53 new custom hills added to DSJ4 Online / Hill record lists

Post by Andrej šunkar »

Hello
I wonder why Oberstdorf KS 106 is not approved, as it is a very good hill. As for the Oslo KS 134, it could also be approved, as it seems there will be no other, only a few updates. It is true that F2 does not look as it should, but you can still jump.
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