On the philosophy of record hunting

[Christian Hermann 2]

trust me .... there WILL be even less attention!!!

anyway
online record feature would be interesting and this is why jussi can do it

although i don't have the time to play online
i go to work, go to gym, have a girlfriend, family and friends and on weekends there are so many things to do which are much more important than dsj records

Playing online needs less time than offline!

[Georg Gasser]

Yes and online is everytime great funny

[Jussi Koskela]

This has to be considered carefully, so I won't give any definitive answers at this point. I'll be following this thread.

[domi_deluxe]

Playing online needs less time than offline!

best statement so far!!!
that is true

maybe i let myself be persuaded to play online ....
maybe ....

[davisp]

I think that a online record list would convince a lot of people to play online. At the moment your online rating is a mixture of skill and consistency. If you haven't got the skill you will not make it on top. If you haven't got the consistency you can't make it on the top in every event. So in my opinion the online rating is the best thing to show the skills of a player and should always stand next to his name. So that everybody knows: This guy is a very good one. But the online record list would bring a new aspect to the game. Just imagine this scenario: You're in an online event and the hill is planica, the wind is also very good. Someone jumps, let's say 239 or 239,5. Without an online record list everybody would congratulate him and say "What an amazing jump". But with an official online record list everybody would freak out, because they just saw a new world record. It would be very exciting with this feature. And I really can't see a contra argument for the online record list. I don't think that the offline record list would lose its prestige. Maybe the community would devide into online jumpers and offline.

For the offline record hunt modus there may be some contra points. Some may say that the game would get too easy. Some may be afraid to lose their #1 position after spending so much time and effort into finding the best conditions.
But I would say: If you are the #1 you got the best skills, because others were also seeking for the best conditions. So if you still spend as much time as before you will stay on top.
For the implementation I would recommend this: Next to Training an own Record Hunt button. With these settings 2.0 m/s and 180 degree. For the gate I would say the actual WR gate. As in Training you will not have 2,5 m/s for every jumper. But a good chance to beat the records without seeking hours for the right conditions in Worldcup.

[domi_deluxe]

offline record feature - NO
because it is a thing of skill, if you do your best jump in the right moment
good wind conditions are found in 2-3 jumpers per 100

online record feature - YES
it would be very interesting
maybe others can jump in the top10 or an wr
it't live and "it's in the game"
more online players
and jussi earns more money

[Szymon11]

offline record feature - NO
because it is a thing of skill, if you do your best jump in the right moment
good wind conditions are found in 2-3 jumpers per 100

online record feature - YES
it would be very interesting
maybe others can jump in the top10 or an wr
it't live and "it's in the game"
more online players
and jussi earns more money

There are more positive sentences, so why not in 1.5.x or in 1.6.0?

[domi_deluxe]

offline record feature - NO
because it is a thing of skill, if you do your best jump in the right moment
good wind conditions are found in 2-3 jumpers per 100

online record feature - YES
it would be very interesting
maybe others can jump in the top10 or an wr
it't live and "it's in the game"
more online players
and jussi earns more money

i meant:
i don't want to have an extra button where i can jump in best wind conditions and the records will count
normal offline mode like now - normal training mode like now

simply adding the online-record-mode

[davisp]

I see the point of Dominik. But waiting for hours to do this jumps is demotivating. Maybe we can find a solution which makes everyone happy.

A special record hunt modus could be: You got 5 jumps with perfect condition (2 m/s, 180 degree front wind and WR gate) on a hill and after the 5 jumps you HAVE to move to the next hill. Something like a season. 5 jumps on every hill. The game saves after every jump automatically.

i.e. it starts in Bad Mitterndorf you do your first 3 jumps, end the game. Start the game again and have 2 jumps left there. After you've done all of the 5 jumps you have to move to Bihofen and so on. So that you are not able to end the modus and start over again until you've done 5 jumps on every hill. I hope everyone can understand as my english is far away from perfect

[davisp]

Any other ideas?

[MJumper]

Yeah, this discussion didn't really take off. I was hoping that people would post their analysis on the issue that I brought up in the OP, but the thread quickly degenerated into a debate about whether or not to implement a certain feature (which was not the only point of the thread). Personally I don't know what more to say.

Maybe if people tried to answer these questions:

1) What is, in your opinion, the fundamental purpose of a record system?
2) How well does the current system achieve this purpose? What are the problems, if any?
3) How could the system be improved in order to better achieve the purpose?

[MJumper]

I'll go first :

1) What is, in your opinion, the fundamental purpose of a record system?

I can think of three aspects:

• A: To explore the potential of each hill, i.e. how long is it possible to jump in each hill.
• B: To compare the level of skill between different players.
• C: To let players enjoy the satisfaction of improving at the game.

2) How well does the current system achieve this purpose? What are the problems, if any?

• A: This goal is achieved perfectly with the current system.
• B: This works to a degree, but the records reflect also other things besides skill
• C: This works when a hill has just been introduced, but after that the amount of time needed to improve a record is not usually worth its reward.

3) How could the system be improved in order to better achieve the purpose?

• A: No changes needed.
• B: Introduce a category of records, where all players have equal opportunities to compete (e.g. online records or tournament records).
• C: Same as B and possibly do something to reduce the amount of time wasted in record hunting, e.g. possibility of filtering out winds that would otherwise be skipped (for example: ability limit the windspeed to X±0.5m/s or angle to Y±45°).

[CalinStelistu]

I don't agree. If a player is really good on a hill, but he sucks on the other ones, he can just try to beat the record on that hill offline, not online .

[davisp]

I want to bring up this discussion again. Most people here agree with the online records idea. So can we expect something there Jussi?

To the record hunting mode: I think it would motivate a lot of players because this time-wasting process of finding the "perfect" conditions isn't necessary anymore.
Some say: It's a sign of skill to make the perfect jump at the right time. I don't think that the wind will be 2,5 m/s all the time in this new mode. Perfect would be a range from 1,8 to 2,5. So you won't have thousands attempts with perfect wind.
I would be interested what Jussi and what the whole community thinks. So that we can bring this issue to an end.

Dear Jussi,
if you consider a record hunting mode then do it if you stand 100% behind it. It is still your game. You develop it. If you want to ask the community, then make a official poll and explain your thoughts how this modus should work.
If you think that this idea is complete shit then just say that this modus will never happen, then we have certainty at least

(ugh... i read my post and it sounds like that I am telling you what to do. I didn't intend to do so. My english isn't so good. So I lack to express myself right. But I hope you know what I mean )

[Maciejo-96]

Good idea, but I don't know it would be easy to implement.

My suggestion to this mode would be only lowest WC gate and +1 gate comparing to it. But you see, it's sometimes heavy to get fastly good wind from gate +1 as possible. But I see positive: a lot of players would fastly get new, great records and rivalry for top places in Total Length classification and for world records would be much interesting.