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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 23:01 
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Joined: 22 Jan 2007, 14:42
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For gibbon it's kind of too late to do anything. Earlier I tried to adjust the physics, so that the jumper would lose control on such moves, but it didn't work out well. For the "slide bug", though, it's still possible to keep resetting hill records that are exploiting it or finally ban players if necessary.

This is what the terms of use say:
Quote:
3.2 f. You may not cheat or use exploits to gain competitive advantage over other players. If such activity is suspected Mediamond may at its sole discretion ban You from the Web Hill Records Database and from the Online Game.


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 00:09 
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Joined: 17 Aug 2012, 13:34
Posts: 1560
Location: Białystok
Seriously, I think everything here is coming to the absolutely wrong way. No matter if slide bug or gibbon, both caused that global hill records list is what at the moment it's - is unfair (and even I have that opinion, owner of offline 3 world records and 14 Polish records, and one online world record which is also my only Polish record; all jumped with gibbon). Where do you see the problem with fixing physics bugs, mostly slide bug and gibbon? If you keep them, the game won't be still as it is written by you on site: "All your movements are simulated accurately according to real-world physics." Last time when I read this I always laugh. Sorry for that, but everyone knows what's the reason of that situation.

Anyway, you wrote "Earlier I tried to adjust the physics, so that the jumper would lose control on such moves, but it didn't work out well.". And now question: Why didn't you ask any experienced and top player to check how he feels that? All this type players for sure could help you with that. The same situation could be also with adjusting the startgates on all hills. Also, "For gibbon it's kind of too late to do anything." For everything it isn't too late! This problem is still topical and serious! And now we have another serious, maybe even a bit more serious, problem with landing slide bugs! We can't ignore that!

But, removing records and, which is the most radical way, banning players who are exploiting both physical bugs to break global hill records, is undoubtedly the worst possible way, because THE PROBLEM WILL STILL EXIST! The only way to solve it is finally make serious changes in jumping physics in-game: trying to make a gibbon should cause in the best case flying too much forward with skis with small chances to defend (in the worst case making frontflip and fall on spine), and now slide bug - trying to do slide by back of skis, when skis touch even a little bit a landing zone, jumper must immediately fall on his knees or spine. There must be keeped the word written on site, which I quote again here: "All your movements are simulated accurately according to real-world physics." Again I bold this sentence to be visible better. Please don't avoid fixing this problem, do what will be the best for everyone playing this game. Without that, the best name for this game isn't "Deluxe Ski Jump 4", but "Deluxe Ski Bug" Why? Because of bugs like: gibbon, slide bug, landed slide bug, Bad Mitterndorf, etc.

And, also, please take a look. We are in 2018 year. And now here is bunch of information about hills.
- hill in Bad Mitterndorf was renewed in 2014 and now has HS on 235 meters
- hill in Engelberg was renewed in 2016 and now has HS on 140 meters
- hill in Oberstdorf was renewed in 2016 and now has HS on 235 meters
- hill in Planica was renewed in 2013-2014 and now has HS on 240 meters
- hill in Sapporo has new snow-profile and HS in it is 137 meters
- large hill in Zakopane was renewed in 2016-2017 and now has HS on 140 meters
- some hills should have updated hill sizes without renewing them: Garmisch-Partenkirchen (140->142), Harrachov (205->210), both Lillehammer (100->98, 138->140), both Val di Fiemme (106->104, 134->135).

Not enough that game is bugged, moreover it's outdated. It's boring to still jump on outdated hills when in real world there are renewed ones.

Don't you think that it's finally time for changes? Or we have to enjoy bugged and outdated game? Are you going to be on players' side or listless side? Please finally decide. We hope your decision will the best for everyone: for you and for all players. Thanks and warm regards (as we say in Poland "pozdrawiam cieplutko") ;)

PS. If you still don't have plans and you don't want to develop this game please finally write on the main site "Development of DSJ series has been officially ended and it won't be launched again."

inb4 tl;dr

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Last edited by Maciejo-96 on 31 Jan 2018, 00:56, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 00:21 
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Joined: 14 Apr 2012, 23:36
Posts: 155
I may be wrong but... I think, the physics of DSJ4 are built so that with low enough sensitivity it is possible actually to do gibbon move through whole jump and still have the balance. The jumper is very rag doll like but the skis always are in the same line even if you pressed another mouse button before another, only the position of jumper is moving in flight. So skis are not working independently as they do in real life? Would this kind of thing prevent gibbon takeoffs?

So I suspect the total change of DSJ4 is actually almost as tricky as making new DSJ game.

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DSJ2 Total Length: 5438,88m
DSJ3 Total Length: 7814,74m
DSJ4 Total Lenght: 3560,25m (offline)

Combined: 16813.87m


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 00:23 
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Joined: 14 Apr 2012, 23:36
Posts: 155
But also we need to remember that Jussi is not working on the game as his primary job now so he would probably need a very long time for any bigger updates, if he is not accepting any help from anyone of course. He cannot sacrifice his primary work for this game, but also, if there is not chance these things would be updated, I suggest it would be clearly told on the main site that the development of the game has been postponed to further future, and if it's ended forever, then that should be said clearly too.

Also, in my opinion new record lists would launch a new boom on this game, and give a chance for many new and probably old players too shine. At the moment it's impossible in most hills. But of course new record lists should be done only when the game is renewed!

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DSJ2 Total Length: 5438,88m
DSJ3 Total Length: 7814,74m
DSJ4 Total Lenght: 3560,25m (offline)

Combined: 16813.87m


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 01 Feb 2018, 23:43 
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Joined: 22 Jan 2007, 14:42
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Hill records exploiting the slide bug will be reseted and earlier second best hill records won't be returned, so please stop submitting those.


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 02 Feb 2018, 01:32 
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Joined: 14 Apr 2012, 23:36
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I just want to say that it doesn't bother me if those records stay on the lists. But I'm a bit sad that nothing will be done about the physics of the game... Maybe we just have to accept the fate of this game and stop posting about the wishes.

Anyway a question that I still sometimes think of. Is there any possibility that Mediamond would be producing something else in the future, than a ski jumping game? Or what about if someone else wanted to continue the project, and would maybe even be ready to pay for it?

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DSJ2 Total Length: 5438,88m
DSJ3 Total Length: 7814,74m
DSJ4 Total Lenght: 3560,25m (offline)

Combined: 16813.87m


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 02 Feb 2018, 23:09 
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Joined: 05 Apr 2015, 12:53
Posts: 105
I talked with Jussi about DSJ4. I wanted to buy the whole DSJ4. I wanted to pay for it.. and i would upgrade the game... but Jussi said no... so i dont believe if hes gonna sell it... :/

Br Nejc


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 02 Feb 2018, 23:20 
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Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 20:50
Posts: 1222
Location: Poland, Kielce
create a new topic, where you'll write that you already bought it, but lost access, just like it is a key ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

there is only one response ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

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JussiKoskela.develop(DSJ);
/* hehe */


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 02 Feb 2018, 23:59 
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Joined: 01 Oct 2009, 22:08
Posts: 6
Location: Poland
I honestly stopped caring about records when most of them were achieved with gibbon. For me the real challenge of each jump is to take off perfectly and sustain that position throughout the flight, without screwing it up.

As to the game development, my opinion has always been the same - if you don't want to develop a game despite the demand, release the code and let others do it (possibly under your supervision so there are no conflicts like using hill names without license etc.).

Another thing which is obviously but not mentioned enough - nobody wants DSJ 5. We just want hills.

Halla'!

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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2018, 01:10 
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Joined: 17 Aug 2012, 13:34
Posts: 1560
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Absolutely disgusting. Removing slide bug records probably without removing this bug. That's what made me disappointed a lot.

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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2018, 03:02 
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Joined: 14 Apr 2012, 23:36
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On the other hand, if we are a bit positive, at least we got DSJ4, because at that point DSJ was already over 11 years old and many other games are already long forgotten after so many years. It was entirely possible that the game would have ''died'' much earlier than 2011 and we would never have got anything newer than DSJ3. So maybe we should thank Jussi for making the last edition of the game, even it was recently proven to be broken in many ways.

Anyway, what happened around 2013-2014, because I saw that in spring 2014 there were some first signs about the loss of popularity, and that ''the game doesn't pay off''? Do you think there was some specific reason why it happened at that time and never was back at the same level? Or was DSJ4 so much more advanced game than DSJ3, that all the time and effort put into it was not worth it?

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DSJ2 Total Length: 5438,88m
DSJ3 Total Length: 7814,74m
DSJ4 Total Lenght: 3560,25m (offline)

Combined: 16813.87m


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 12 Feb 2018, 15:39 
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Joined: 12 Feb 2018, 15:21
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Maciejo-96 wrote:
Finally. It's sad there wouldn't be something done to block Cheat Engine activity in DSJ4 proccess...

Hi,
I would be say that it needs to have insurance for this situations :)


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2018, 20:13 
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Joined: 07 Feb 2017, 00:57
Posts: 12
krzysztof przykorski 2 has wr on bad mitendorf, harrachov, planica val di fieme hs 106 and zakopane hs134. on online over 260 meters on bad mittendorf


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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2018, 00:47 
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Joined: 17 Aug 2012, 13:34
Posts: 1560
Location: Białystok
Well done Kubikal, now amoebas learned from you how to make impossible records using Cheat Engine
Please finally solve forever problem of cheated records. We know it is very difficult, but it is really important to make this game free from cheats.
And remember that I fight for it for a long time.

inb4 and says it player who uses gibbon in his jumps

As I wrote many times, gibbon is not a cheat, it is a bug. Serious bug. Together with slide bug (also with landing). Also remember what did you write 4 years ago: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=5926&start=135#p71159
I bold here one of the sentences from that post: If some serious bugs come out I will of course fix them.

Hm? DSJ4 is seriously bugged. Very seriously.

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 Post subject: Re: Fake Records
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2018, 01:36 
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Joined: 01 Oct 2009, 22:08
Posts: 6
Location: Poland
If Jussi ever managed to fix gibbon it would probably impact the physics of the game in general and make it different, causing an uproar and protests. I wouldn't count on that.

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